Why exactly is our OL so bad?

Pouncey going down obviously changes a lot... But when you look at each guy across the line, individually, they look good. I had high hopes that this was the year that our OL became a strength.

Mike Adams - He's young, and raw, but I have high hopes that he can be good. His technique needs work but he's already a pretty good run blocker. I'm not sure he's naturally a LT.

Ramon Foster - Not a pro bowler by any means, but he's an average NFL starter.

Maurkice Pouncey - All pro. Nuff' said.

David DeCastro - Struggled a little as a rookie, but already improved a lot this season. I think he'll eventually be very good.

Marcus Gilbert - He's just bad. If we didn't need Beachem to move around so much everywhere else, I would say Beachem should start here. Gilbert has gotten worse since his rookie season in my opinion.



I'm starting to think we need to grab a left tackle in round 1 next year and move Adams back to the right side.

 

Foster is to big and slow to zone block...
Pouncey is not strong enough to play center..
Adams is a true RT as you stated..
Gilbert is no good as you stated.
Decastro needs to play beside a Bigger stronger Center and get Gilbert far away from him....

 

Yeah, Pouncey at Center doesnt really impress me. I liked him at LG (or wherever he played last year for a game or two). Foster is average. I like DD and Adams as you both have said. Gilbert...ugh.

 

we may not have to worry about pouncey anymore. this could go a lot of different ways with him.

foster is to slow as pwp says. I've said that for awhile now. first off he's slow getting to his double team block , and then even slower getting off that block to the LB'ers. this right off the bat spells trouble for the zone scheme.

I do believe adams should be on the right side. if we need him to swing back to the left for a game or two that's different he is good enough for that.

DD needs to see what he's hitting and how he's hitting them. on one sack which I pointed out in another thread, he knocked our blocker (beachum and gilbert) off their blocks by helping if that's what you want to call it. missed his cut and hit pouncey because he is not as quick off the ball as pouncey and was late getting there. he's knocking the snot out of people but a lot of the time it's his own men.

gilbert, what can I say, he looks very lost at times and can't stay with his blocks.

they don't play as a unit and are matched up wrong in quickness and skill.

i'm not sure why we would keep beachum as a backup. he is one of the best 5 we have.

I said before not knowing how well Wallace would play at guard but I think it would be worth a try. my line going forward would consist of beachum at LT, DD at LG, valasco at center, Wallace at RG and adams at RT.

they don't switch off well and haven't for years on late blitzers. they over commit to double teams and open rush lanes for the defense which get's them spread to wide. they get walked back into the pocket way to easy as they play to high. a lot of these things are fixable. gilbert needs tried at RG where I think he could be a better fit.

all I can say is Cameron erving RD.1 next year and travis swanson Rd.2 at Center/Guard. Sorensen at safety in the 3rd. what will hurt is leaving kyle van noy out unless we make some deals or trades for a second first rounder. that's my story and i'm sticking to it.

 

Our linemen are soft with the exception of Pouncey and Decastro. They're soft! They are just big and fat... no strength. No push in the run game.

 

why?

 

I've been wondering the same thing. We may have the worst line in the NFL and we seem to every year. I was watching the Pats and Jets game last night thinking that both of those offensive lines seem light years ahead of ours.

You know, mac, I was thinking the same thing this week. Pouncey has been injury prone and has, quite honestly, seemed to regress in the last year or so. The "Free Hernandez" hat episode was just stupido! He strikes me as the kind of guy who may want to defect to South Beach (see Wallace, Mike) when his contract is up to play with his brother. When we signed Fernando Velasco the other day, my thought was could this guy be our center for the forseeable future?

 

I agree jack and have made those two points. I like pouncey don't get me wrong but these are two big factors in us keeping him I believe.

if we had a better matchup with him on the interior, I think we would see a better showing by him. he's quick and can hit multiple targets in the run game, but foster teamed up next to him counters everything he can do.

valasco should be a better match speed wise with foster and DD, but we will lose mobility and second level quickness. that kills some of the ZBS's effectiveness. it will help anchor against big men pushing their way into our backfield though as that cat for the titans did all game. it wasn't as much over beachum as it was against foster though. he owned foster.

 

Yes on both accounts!

We have a hodge podge of skill sets and talents on our OL and I'm not really sure why. Is there a disconnect between scouting, coaching, and personnel dept? It seemed that a few years ago we only drafted the big, powerful linemen, like Stai and Faneca, etc. Now it appears like we draft all over the place, with small quick guys like Pouncey and Beachum mixed with the powerful guys like Adams and Urbik. Why is there no consistency? Either draft the big earth movers from Alabama and Wisconsin, or focus on the smaller athletic linemen and mimic the Bronco lines of years ago.

As far as Gilbert starting over Beachum, well I think that's ridiculous. Gilbert is neither quick nor powerful, so not sure what he brings to the table. At least with Beachum they will have another guy suited to play in the zone scheme they want to implement.

Bottom line is that individually our OL shouldn't be as bad as they are collectively, as we have some talented players. Three OL coaches in 5 years doesn't help things out, either.

 

foster is a right guard at best adams a right tackle , i would try decastro at left guard we still need a left tackle , gilbert is a backup , we can try beachum

 

This sums it up.

 

The problem is we started these 1st and 2nd year players to soon. I think you need a mixture of veterans and these type players on an offensive line.

Pouncey is a good center. He just been ate up so far this season
Foster is average and should be a career backup.
DeCastro should be alright later but for a guy that was projected as the best guard in the draft fell to us at 17 (i think) should be a concern.
Adams should not be starting at left tackle. He can not pass block to save his life and it doesn't seem he improved much since last year when he was on the right side. Now, he might be better in a few years but he is a project.
Gilbert looks horrible over the preseason games and this first game. He also needs some alot of work.

When you combine all that with a starting offensive line you are going to have problems. I know we were tight against the cap but we should have tried to keep Starks for another year. I know he sucked in San Diego but you can't underestimate his desire to protect Ben. And I know he is slow for the blocking scheme we are trying to run, but we only ran it once in the titans game.

And even if we didn't get to resign Starks they need some veteran leadership on that line and slowly infuse the younger guys (Adams, DeCastro, and Gilbert) throughout the season or next year. Collective I don't think they are ready yet. And by time they are Ben will be hurt, or a year or two older.

We probably could of cut Dwyer and Redman and saved enough to get a legitmate left tackle. Probably could of cut Plaxico to save a little there. We should of let Foote go to add to the bank for an offensive lineman. Nothing will run correctly without an OFFENSIVE LINE. Period.

 

If I remember correctly, wasn't the line formation during the first half of last season Starks/Legs/Pouncey/Foster/Adams? Then it obviously changed a billion times, but couldn't we bring back Starks to play LT this year, move foster to RG, move DD to LG, and Adams back to RT?

I know the team wants to get the young guns playing time, but the current formation seems bad, as does Gilbert.

Also, decisions like switching to a zoneblocking scheme with this skillset of lineman is what I think a lot of fans are tired of with the Tomlin administration.

 

Lacking strength, speed, size, poor blocking along with not making their assignments. Its obvious with Ben @ 5 sacks in one game what's the number going to be this week or won't we really know.. if Ben goes down early!

 

I'ts a combination of poor player evaluation, and bad coaching, but no problem, Tomlin takes full responsibility for it.........

 

Finally somebody said Coaching. I was getting a little worried there for a minute. When it's been going on the longer side of a decade then it boils mostly down to confusion. Whether the players are just not understanding what the scheme is or they are being used incorrectly is more concerning to me then the physical ability.

DD and Pouncey were not on the same page IMO and now the better of the two is done for the year or possibly longer.

 

injuries

 

Man, I miss that guy and his nasty attitude. I wouldn't mind seeing Jarvis get kicked out of a game BEFORE IT STARTS the way Peezy did a few years ago against the Clowns. We need that!

 

I miss him too, which is why I'm so pissed that we didn't grab Vontaze Burfict. He's that guy. JJ, Timmons, Burfict, Woodley... damn!

 

sarcasm?

 

I'm sure we'll get a healthy dose of Mr. Burfict Monday night!

 

Oh no. DEAD serious.

We need that kind of attitude on this defense again. We don't have it and our defense has become plain vanilla, effective but tasteless. Peezy just had that attitude that nobody was going to come into our house and disrespect us. I actually think Ray Lewis was AFRAID of Joey. Joey actually went looking for Ray Ray on the team bus one year after a game and Lewis was cowering in the back seat. He didn't want any part of Peezy!

 

[video=youtube;gpOG9K02F_g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gpOG9K02F_g[/video]

 

LOL, I get what you're saying about missing Peezy's attitude. I was just shocked you wanted to see JJ kicked out of a game before it started. And then wrote "we need that"

I kinda knew what you were getting at but the more I thought about it I wasn't 100% sure, lol