Intriguing question: If Brady had the Steelers' defense...?

I thought this was a thought provoking article by John Harris of the PTR. It seems we're wasting a pretty good defense with our offensive ineptitude. Something has to change and I believe that "something" needs to be that Ben needs to become more of a student of the game. His physical prowess is diminishing and it's time he realizes that film study and game prep is what will carry him the second half of his career.

Here is an interesting excerpt from the article:

Roethlisberger has played on five teams that led the league in total defense. Imagine how many Super Bowls Tom Brady could win if he played with a dominant defense

Read more: http://triblive.com/sports/johnharris/3219498-74/offense-defense-steelers#ixzz2Gkb5yYuK
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I'm not sure I put as much faith in the ranking systems as that writer does. He seems to be saying (and I could be reading this wrong) that unless we have a top 5 passing offense, we are letting the defense down. This is nonsense. We didn't win our last two superbowls doing that. In fact, I'm not sure we did that for much of the 70's.

The offense were pretty woeful this season, but you don't need Brady to turn the defensuve successes into wins - you need a few less picks, a few less penalties, a few less fumbles and so on.

The article also seems to miss how for the first few games we were complaining about how weak the defense was...

 

How about if Brady got sacked 5 times a game. How many games would he win.

 

Brady knows how to get rid of the football.

 

I wonder if the writer ever considered how awesome Brady's o-line has been during all his time vs. Ben's except for maybe his first season.

Nobody is as much of a critic of Ben and his bone headedness than me (a few member her can attest to it) and except his toughness he needs to develop a lot more skills in preperation as well as on the field.

I think Brady is great and arguably the best and def in the top 3 Qb's ever, but he wouldn't have such a great career with Ben's line or his system. Brady is in a near perfect system for him and a smart coach who fortified everything around him.

 

This is evident. The offense needs to step it up and get better, smarter,more consistent, etc.

They put the defense in bad position so much it isn't funny. And our fans complain when the defense give up a FG after the offense or special teams gives the ball to the opponent in our territory.

 

The weakest part of the Pats team this year is definitely their Oline, it's awful. Is it as bad as ours? Who knows, they seem to do a much better job masking their weaknesses than we do. Brady changes the protection a lot, including with as little as 1-2 seconds left on the play clock, plus he gets rid of the ball very quickly. Plus they run such a high tempo offence that it tires out the pass rushers. I've watched and played enough football to know that when pass rushers constantly end up empty handed and can't get to the QB, it tires them out for faster than if they are getting to the QB, even if the same number of players have been ran. When pass rushers get hits on the QB, it fires them up, gets them motivated, and gives them confidence. When they keep getting there in 2-3 seconds only to find the ball is gone, it's very deflating.

The Oline is always blamed for our problems, and our Oline is bad, but Ben makes them seem worse than they truly are. Every time Ben lets them sack him, he's giving them a shot in the arm and makes them try even harder. A lot of the sacks Ben takes are his own fault. If Ben would throw the ball away before the rush got to him, it would make our Oline look significantly better.

You can point to the Oline all day long, but GB has just as bad of an Oline, if not worse, yet Rodgers still put up very, very good numbers and has his team in the playoffs.

 

Actually, Brady won his first Super Bowl, and possibly one of the other two, BECAUSE of his defense. In fact, the Patriots don't even SNIFF their first Lombardi without a tuck, a punt return for a TD, a blocked kick for a TD, and a Ty Law pick 6. The Pats had more returns for TDs than Brady-led drives for TDs that entire 2001 post-season.

As for Brady's play itself, don't get me started. One of the most overrated players in NFL history. This doesn't mean I don't think he's a great QB, a tremendous leader. But that offense is a well-oiled system, with all 11 guys doing their jobs to a masterful degree. Brady is one cog in that system. And almost any QB can execute it...oh, wait, didn't Matt cassell win 11 games with that offense and have a higher rating in his first season as starter than Brady did in his? And Cassell had not started a game since high school.

It's about the system. It's the most well-executed, well-designed offense I have ever seen. It's designed much like the West Coast offense, and any time Brady drops back to air it out, he has all day and/or a wide open receiver to chuck it to. Watch these "highlights"....at least have of these ANY QB could complete.

[video=youtube;uIJCiEa6zTc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIJCiEa6zTc[/video]

 

really. Last year when we got up on wrs. We sacked him and pressured him. I am just happy we have a legit qb who gives us a chance to win every game we play. Some weeks he is the best in the NFL. Some weeks this year he has not been. But, he takes a bigger pounding than all but rodgers. And Rodgers has not been that good this year as his oline has struggled.

 

I'm not going to bother watching the whole thing. I've watched enough of Brady to know what he is capable of. I did watch the first 7 plays though and here's my take

Play 1 - Welker is not wide open. Brady floated it in perfectly to him, something Ben has proven incapable of doing his entire career. Ben can fling it in a tight window, but floating a ball over top of a defender is something Ben cannot do, and it's something many QB's can't do consistently.

Play 2 - Sure, great route by one of the greatest WR's ever, but it's still a good throw, something Ben regularly misses. How many times has Ben under-thrown a wide open WR deep down the field?


Play 3 - Another good throw, and on top of that, he took advantage of the mismatch. It sure does show why we need a TE like Gronk or Graham, a guy who can stretch the field. Heath is too slow.


Play 4 - Good route running, but again, it's a good throw as well


Play 5 - Found Gronk, who is in double coverage. Pocket broke down within 2 seconds yet Brady got rid of it instead of scrambling.


Play 6 - Perfect throw. Had to put it over top of the defender where only the WR could get it.

On almost all of those plays the ball was gone from his hand within 3 seconds. On a couple of those plays the pocket had either collapsed or was just about to and he got rid of it instead of scrambling. I don't see how you can claim his success relies on the system and anyone can execute it. Matt Cassell was good in NE, but Belichek turned him into a game manager. Notice how Randy Moss had 30 less receptions, 500 less yards and 12 less TD's with Cassell then he did the year before with Brady. That's not a fluke. Matt Cassell didn't do half of what Brady did. QB rating means very little, especially when you're constantly checking down and throwing nothing but underneath stuff.

You can say all you want about that offence, but no other Belichek QB has been able to do what Brady has.

 

Not that good? Rodgers had 350 less yards and 6 less TD's than his ridiculous year he had last year. If that's not that good, then I can't imagine what good would look like.

 

maybe part of it is brady gets rid fo the ball a lot faster than ben and when he sees its sack time he gets rid of the ball?

HINES

 

I am not making excuses for Ben. I am not comparing Ben to Brady. But it sure helps when your primary receiver is usually open, with nobody around him.

 

I'm not going to bother watching the whole thing. I've watched enough of Brady to know what he is capable of. I did watch the first 7 plays though and here's my take

Play 1 - Welker is not wide open. Brady floated it in perfectly to him, something Ben has proven incapable of doing his entire career. Ben can fling it in a tight window, but floating a ball over top of a defender is something Ben cannot do, and it's something many QB's can't do consistently.

Play 2 - Sure, great route by one of the greatest WR's ever, but it's still a good throw, something Ben regularly misses. How many times has Ben under-thrown a wide open WR deep down the field?


Play 3 - Another good throw, and on top of that, he took advantage of the mismatch. It sure does show why we need a TE like Gronk or Graham, a guy who can stretch the field. Heath is too slow.


Play 4 - Good route running, but again, it's a good throw as well


Play 5 - Found Gronk, who is in double coverage. Pocket broke down within 2 seconds yet Brady got rid of it instead of scrambling.


Play 6 - Perfect throw. Had to put it over top of the defender where only the WR could get it.

On almost all of those plays the ball was gone from his hand within 3 seconds. On a couple of those plays the pocket had either collapsed or was just about to and he got rid of it instead of scrambling. I don't see how you can claim his success relies on the system and anyone can execute it. Matt Cassell was good in NE, but Belichek turned him into a game manager. Notice how Randy Moss had 30 less receptions, 500 less yards and 12 less TD's with Cassell then he did the year before with Brady. That's not a fluke. Matt Cassell didn't do half of what Brady did. QB rating means very little, especially when you're constantly checking down and throwing nothing but underneath stuff.

You can say all you want about that offence, but no other Belichek QB has been able to do what Brady has. [/QUOTE]

First 6:00 or so:

1. Great play, no doubt.
2. No pass rush. As usual, Brady has time for a latte.
3. Again, no rush. Brady went to his primary who has a step on everyone.
4. My favorite, and the typical Brady deep pass. No rush, and Welker is wide open.
5. Good play, one of the best in this video.
6. All day to throw, and anyone other than Moss doesn’t catch that.
7. All day to throw, receiver has a step. Good deep ball.
8. TOUGH TOUGH TD pass, there. (eyes rolling)
9. Even easier than #8.
10. Yep. A littler pass rush, but an open receiver who has the inside. Pitch and catch. Again.
11. Not a pass.
12. Trickery…wide open WR. The Pats’ plays like this work because they are not only perfectly executed (most of the time) but because they are called at the most perfect moments.
13. Has to run out of the pocket a little, but Moss is wide open.
14. Brady did nothing here but dump it off.
15. WIDE OPEN Welker. Sense a pattern here?
16. No pass rush easy TD pass.
17. Not sure why so many highlights come from this blowout in the snow, but so be it. This was a back shoulder throw, Brady and Moss were in sync.
18. Easy. No pass rush, open receiver.
19. All day to throw, good pass.
20. All day to throw, open receiver.
21. Good throw…no pass rush, again.
22. Easy.
23. No pass.
24. All day to throw, WR has the inside.
25. Same old story: no pass rush, open receiver.
26. This one is awesome. Deep throw to a wide open WR, wasn’t touched. Brady is completely unharrassed until delivering the ball…and he didn’t need to even step into it.
27. One of my favorites. WHAT A THING OF BEAUTY, huh? 5:21 mark. Y’all need to see this one. That’s a HOF play right there. A junior high schooler could make that throw.
28. Ben-like play there.

 

But, Greg, don't you think it's a legitimate criticism of Ben to say that he's a little slow when reading defenses and at times misses an open receiver or checkdown which causes plays to break down thus necessitating him scrambling around frenetically trying to make a play?? That bird flies when you're in your prime physically but when you get older and don't have the physical prowess you once did that bird's wings are clipped! For Ben to have success in the second half of his career he simply MUST get smarter, spend more time in the film room and prepare better!

 

exactly

 

I love how big ben can get away from defenders even if it causes him to throw a few more Ints no wAy brady has the ability to play like that so i think ill just keep Ben....i hAve been very happy with him sofar​

 

But the point is that his escapability is diminishing as he ages. With some exceptions it seemed that he lost some of his mobility this past season. With age and wear and tear, he will become less mobile ad that's been what's made Ben Ben. He needs to transform himself into a more cerebral QB in order to recapture his past successes. I remain hopeful that Haley can help him do this.

 

beat me to it

 

man if it was as easy as just matching up one of the best qbs in the game with the top defense everyone would be doing it.

its called catching lightning in a bottle and the Steelers have done it 6 times. thats more than any other team has ever done it.

the Steelers have done this twice. once with Bradshaw and the other time with Ben. Bradshaw got them 4 ring and Ben has 2 plus one other trip to a super bowl. we are very spoiled as Steeler fans.

getting to a super bowl is hard enough let alone winning one. they are not going to win one every year. the fact that they are the most prolific team when it comes to super bowls and they only have 6 considering how many super bowls have been played tells you all you need to know about just how rare a super bowl win is.

lets all stop trying to run Ben out of town and lets see what happens next season.

 

I'll echo what was said earlier, Brady has 10 other guys doing their job and doing it well, something our QB doesn't have. Brady with our oline would be mediocre and yes, I am saying it because I watched how the Jets beat him by sacking him twice and after that he wasn't too good, in fact every time he gets beat it is due to pressure and not just a few plays but constant pressure. Look how P. Manning does with it...Remember when we beat them, the thing that did it was hitting him over and over and I would bet my house that if Tom Brady was here he would be injured or have a 6-10 season because he can't scramble well consistantly and lets face facts, Ben has to run for his life on almost every play, easy to make a throw when you can sit in the pocket and follow through. I also looked up a neat stat and when the Pats win he get hit no more that 12 times per game, Ben gets that in the first possession on a game.

 

Brady would be out of the NFL by now, due to some career ending injury. The Steelers O-line would have put Brady in a wheelchair.

 

"If Ben Roethlisberger had New England's offensive line..."

 

1

I agree he should get rid sometimes quicker. But I also think we have not created mismatches in the passing game for us. Like the good teams do. Just think Ben does a lot of things those guys cannot do. Plus and minus with each.What